Holtmann lost the game with his starting 5 not scoring for nearly 5 minutes. I would like to see what 6'8" Etzler could do with some meaningful minutes.
Etzler definitely, and perhaps a few minutes to Bowen Hardman. Hardman doesn't have the body, but he might be able to knock down a few shots from 3 and give us a lift on the scoreboard.
Holtmann has a choice to make. Light a fire under Sueing and try to get him going, or start giving some of his minutes to somebody else that can score, isn't hesitant, and doesn't turn the ball over.
Etzler shouldn't have gotten a scholarship if he is unable to play at this level. This is year two for him, he has to show something or go to a smaller less competitive school and play ball. Holtmann needs to play him if the guy is really bad, he might as well find out now. Your veterans are already playing poorly might as well give him a chance. Buckeyes should just play the young players now. They have nothing to lose. Okpara and the freshmen just need time to develop. It's sad it has to be trial by fire with these guys. Hardman is undersized right now, he needs a year to develop his body.
CH has proven he can’t win with some NBA talent. What makes you think guys off the bench will somehow achieve beyond the coach and his div II skills? I’m not saying you’re wrong because I don’t know much about those two guys. But right now we have very good players losing to inferior talent. They often fail after time outs, and can’t get out of the first 2 rounds of tournaments year after year. This seems to indicate that the millionaire with the whistle is the problem. No?
Standings tell you about the B10 this year. It's full of basically the same thing- no great teams and a bunch of good but flawed teams capable of winning or losing any night. Same with osu. They can absolutely win at Nebraska. They can also absolutely lose 5 in a row. It's tough when you can't close a game to save your life and your coach is literally a minus on the sidelines especially down the stretch. But big picture is really what matters and enough is enough there.
After six seasons we have all seen all we’re ever going to see from Holtmann. Maybe one of these days the Buckeyes might finally hire a coach who can win the B1G and perhaps a National title. One can hope!
Honestly this was the type of game that there’s no shame in losing. That was a tough environment going against one of the best defensive teams in CBB. It was the games that they gave away (Purdue,North Carolina) or just didn’t show up (Minnesota,Maryland) that are inexcusable.
Offensive efficiency ranking under Holt (via KP): 23, 84, 13, 4, 13, 6. You will be hard pressed to find more than a handful of programs that can match or better those numbers.
The Rutgers game was rough. The offense has been pretty efficient this year otherwise.
Jay Wright, a guy whose name Holtmann invokes, is a gentleman, good guy, and credit to Villanova basketball (still) - but the man wasdialed in! His players knew there was a standard to be upheld and he recruited to those standards. His players were tough! I really don't know what Holtmann is trying to accomplish with how he runs his program - I only see a cheerleader. The standard seems to be:
"Come on guys! I know we can do this!."
"Well okay, coach."
Just not really seeing anything much different than that out on the court.
And somewhere CHB smiles, knowingly...while echoes of "we got him now' ring in their ears... It was always about PoR. Those poor useful idiots...
Before the season. "This is our year to make some noise. We have Sueing back and great veterans in McNeil and Holden and our freshman are phenoms". So some people said. They forgot that Holtmann was still the coach.
There really isn’t anything more to be said. Change players every year but the one constant is the coach. The time has come to change the coach. I don’t think it’s any more difficult than that. Pay the man Gene and move on, it didn’t work out. Tough business, sometimes mistakes need to be owned.
I tend to agree with the majority of posters here. Gene needs to let Holtmann go and let Diebler finish the season with the team. If it doesn’t work out then begin a national search at the end of the season. Enough is enough.
Just wish the Buckeye fans would support the women's basketball team by filling the Schott every time they play! So sad that an undefeated women's team doesn't get half the support a sub-par men's team gets in filling the seats.
Just play. Have fun. Enjoy the game. -- Michael Jordan
I believe that the players showed up for this game however “clutch” didn’t come along for the ride. The game was there to be won, but ultimately the desire didn’t take over. Unforced turnovers and the unwillingness to rebound hurt big time. Tell me if this sounds familiar, “long shots make for long rebounds”. And Please please please stop getting beat off the dribble. If you haven’t figured it out, it leads to lay ups, fouls and wide open 3 pointers.
I agree about that. Sueing is killing this team. But Holtmann doesn’t have the balls to make a decision like that. When asked about his team’s four game losing streak, he calmly looked into the eyes of the reporter and said, “if you think that’s bad, just hold my beer and watch.”
When telling the truth becomes a revolutionary concept, it’s wise to join the revolution
"Ohio State finished with its first sub-40% shooting night of the season in Thursday’s loss to Minnesota...After the fact, Holtmann called it “our poorest offensive game of the year.”
And his solution to that was to move the team's leading scorer to the bench and to start the team's worst scorer.
Lol.
Fire the guy. Now. He's in way over his head.
I tried to tell people back in the spring to calm down about Likekele, that he's not going to change the program for the better, that his numbers at Oklahoma State were a function of time on the floor, not efficiency of production. And his time on the floor was a function of being a likable guy who's also a security blanket for any coach who needs one - and I was afraid Holtmann would be just such a coach.
The point of this post isn't to dump on Likekele, but to highlight in such a great example that Holtmann doesn't know how to win at this level of basketball. He doesn't understand the primacy of punishing, relentless scoring pressure above favoring a defensive-minded approach.
I feel like Holtmann is panicking and reverting back to his security blanket in his defensive-minded approach.
I feel compelled to point out that in the prior three games before Holtmann reinserted Likekele back into the starting lineup Likekele played 11, 24 and 18 minutes against Purdue, Maryland and Minnesota, respectively - producing a grand total of 4 points! So then Holtmann rewards that by giving him the start against Rutgers in which he scores zero points in 18 minutes, in a 4-point OT loss. In fact, OSU has lost all four of those games. I don't really know what problem Holtmann thought he was fixing with that move, but that level of lack of production can't possibly fix anything in a meaningful way. Gayle and Sensebaugh are works in progress, and going to make mistakes, as will Holden. But giving their minutes to Likekele is not the answer.
After seeing that defensive starting lineup today the only thing that surprised me is that Holtmann didn't start Eugene Brown, too, and try to hold Rutgers scoreless to halftime.
Holtmann's just making decisions that an elite coach wouldn't make, and I believe he needs to be making those decisions at some other school.
And somewhere CHB smiles, knowingly...while echoes of "we got him now' ring in their ears... It was always about PoR. Those poor useful idiots...
What was it this time? 7 Assists? Nice use of the passing game. They don't even run a good break most of the time. Oh well, the women are unbeaten and I hear the Covelli Center is an actual good environment for bball.
Last time I checked, Sueing just cleared the medical requirements right before the season started. Looked great early on, now looks tired. Etzler should spell Sueing a little bit more until Sueing gets his legs under him. What happens in late February/early March? TBD. Perhaps Sueing pushes through and leads us past the first weekend... time will tell...either way, Holman IS on the hot seat. If it works out, he keeps his job. If this team craps the bed, GOODBYE
It is never right to do what is wrong.
It is never wrong to do what is right.
It is always right to do what is right.
Comments Show All Comments
Holtmans offense always sputters. It's grade school motion with everyone standing around.
“Even if you’re on the right track, you’ll get run over if you just sit there.” - Will Rogers
Holtmann!
TBDSNITL: The best damn screen name in the land!
Some grade school coaches may be insulted.
The more things "change," the more things stay the same.
Just play. Have fun. Enjoy the game. -- Michael Jordan
Fire him now
Holtmann lost the game with his starting 5 not scoring for nearly 5 minutes. I would like to see what 6'8" Etzler could do with some meaningful minutes.
Raider85
Etzler definitely, and perhaps a few minutes to Bowen Hardman. Hardman doesn't have the body, but he might be able to knock down a few shots from 3 and give us a lift on the scoreboard.
Holtmann has a choice to make. Light a fire under Sueing and try to get him going, or start giving some of his minutes to somebody else that can score, isn't hesitant, and doesn't turn the ball over.
I've seen enough Sueing, thanks. He's like a 9th year senior and is what he is which is a liability at this point in crunch time.
Tell Sueing to find his spot on the bench and get comfortable.
Sorry, but Etzler would get eaten alive with this level of play.
Sani
Etzler shouldn't have gotten a scholarship if he is unable to play at this level. This is year two for him, he has to show something or go to a smaller less competitive school and play ball. Holtmann needs to play him if the guy is really bad, he might as well find out now. Your veterans are already playing poorly might as well give him a chance. Buckeyes should just play the young players now. They have nothing to lose. Okpara and the freshmen just need time to develop. It's sad it has to be trial by fire with these guys. Hardman is undersized right now, he needs a year to develop his body.
BuckeyeYankee
CH has proven he can’t win with some NBA talent. What makes you think guys off the bench will somehow achieve beyond the coach and his div II skills? I’m not saying you’re wrong because I don’t know much about those two guys. But right now we have very good players losing to inferior talent. They often fail after time outs, and can’t get out of the first 2 rounds of tournaments year after year. This seems to indicate that the millionaire with the whistle is the problem. No?
This^^
Just play. Have fun. Enjoy the game. -- Michael Jordan
Very doubtful these guys go into Pinnacle Bank Arena on Wednesday and end the streak.
Year 6 and I don’t think we can beat Nebraska on the road.
"We didn't play with enough force tonight"
Standings tell you about the B10 this year. It's full of basically the same thing- no great teams and a bunch of good but flawed teams capable of winning or losing any night. Same with osu. They can absolutely win at Nebraska. They can also absolutely lose 5 in a row. It's tough when you can't close a game to save your life and your coach is literally a minus on the sidelines especially down the stretch. But big picture is really what matters and enough is enough there.
Well when you just stand around while one guy dribbles the ball it’s not hard to defend and makes it hard to get good shots….
After six seasons we have all seen all we’re ever going to see from Holtmann. Maybe one of these days the Buckeyes might finally hire a coach who can win the B1G and perhaps a National title. One can hope!
Try not to suck
When was the last time the men's BB team won the big ten?
2012
This is currently our second longest drought in program history.
When Holtmann arrived, we led the conference in championships with 22.
Thank ya...+1
Is Thad available?
In Antoine Winfield I trust
Craig Zak
Holtmann cannot coach bb at this level. We've seen it now for 6 fuckin' years!!
http://URLWoody 1
Honestly this was the type of game that there’s no shame in losing. That was a tough environment going against one of the best defensive teams in CBB. It was the games that they gave away (Purdue,North Carolina) or just didn’t show up (Minnesota,Maryland) that are inexcusable.
Stop it
They don’t play defense and the offense is middle school level.
Stay gold, Ponyboy.
Don't insult middle school coaches. The offense is elementary, my dear.
Just play. Have fun. Enjoy the game. -- Michael Jordan
Offensive efficiency ranking under Holt (via KP): 23, 84, 13, 4, 13, 6. You will be hard pressed to find more than a handful of programs that can match or better those numbers.
The Rutgers game was rough. The offense has been pretty efficient this year otherwise.
really do not see much hustle from the Buckeyes now for 6 years.
Not sure if coach doesn't work them hard enough or what.At this age conditionong should not be that hard to accomplish.
McNeil was sucking air so bad I thought he might pass out.
Teams take on the personality of their coach.
Jay Wright, a guy whose name Holtmann invokes, is a gentleman, good guy, and credit to Villanova basketball (still) - but the man was dialed in! His players knew there was a standard to be upheld and he recruited to those standards. His players were tough! I really don't know what Holtmann is trying to accomplish with how he runs his program - I only see a cheerleader. The standard seems to be:
"Come on guys! I know we can do this!."
"Well okay, coach."
Just not really seeing anything much different than that out on the court.
And somewhere CHB smiles, knowingly...while echoes of "we got him now' ring in their ears... It was always about PoR. Those poor useful idiots...
Before the season. "This is our year to make some noise. We have Sueing back and great veterans in McNeil and Holden and our freshman are phenoms". So some people said. They forgot that Holtmann was still the coach.
Ohio state basketball will never be a contender. For some reason they can't recruit for a national title plain and simple.
OhioBuckU
OSU talent is better than Rutgers talent.
Rutgers coaching is way better than OSU coaching.
There's no way in hell that osu has better talent than rutgers. They have the most athletic team in the big. Not the best, the most athletic.
I put osu's talent at 8th-9th in the big. But md. may have a bit more talent. Talking about top 8 players on each team.
In order; not including injuries. like iu now has two starters out.
pu-will fr. guards hold up
iu-up and down but 2 starters out, if they come back will it be too late
msu-can play well-inconsistent but talented
um-coming around, didn't play hard in preseason
ru-most athetic team, most defensively in tune team, decent offensively
ia-inconsistent but injuries have hurt development
il-playing below talent level, but dainja is a load-sometimes,
md-since they beat osu, talent is similar, they play like they don't know each other
os-avg. talent, avg. team, have a lot of work to do to get an 8-10 seed
nw-surprise team of big, poor coaching, talented guards, buie is a wild card
wi-typical wi team, but poor offensively, a top player has been out
ne-better than last year but not good
mn-good coach, can't get recruits, portal here we come
There really isn’t anything more to be said. Change players every year but the one constant is the coach. The time has come to change the coach. I don’t think it’s any more difficult than that. Pay the man Gene and move on, it didn’t work out. Tough business, sometimes mistakes need to be owned.
jNowie
I tend to agree with the majority of posters here. Gene needs to let Holtmann go and let Diebler finish the season with the team. If it doesn’t work out then begin a national search at the end of the season. Enough is enough.
starters were Okpara, Likeley. McNeil, Sueing, and Thornton? No wonder they couldn't score to open to game. Three non-scorers on the court.
Thankful for the Lady Bucks.
Go Bucks! TTUN tears are best! Beat Wisky!!!
Just wish the Buckeye fans would support the women's basketball team by filling the Schott every time they play! So sad that an undefeated women's team doesn't get half the support a sub-par men's team gets in filling the seats.
Just play. Have fun. Enjoy the game. -- Michael Jordan
Holtmann before he’s done here
When telling the truth becomes a revolutionary concept, it’s wise to join the revolution
I believe that the players showed up for this game however “clutch” didn’t come along for the ride. The game was there to be won, but ultimately the desire didn’t take over. Unforced turnovers and the unwillingness to rebound hurt big time. Tell me if this sounds familiar, “long shots make for long rebounds”. And Please please please stop getting beat off the dribble. If you haven’t figured it out, it leads to lay ups, fouls and wide open 3 pointers.
If we lose 7 of 8. Does Gene pull the trigger? Doubtful, but this is starting to feel like the end of the Matta era
Seems as if we'd have to lose every remaining game in order for Gene to even get the gun out of the holster.
Just play. Have fun. Enjoy the game. -- Michael Jordan
Sueing's minutes need reduced
puddy
I agree about that. Sueing is killing this team. But Holtmann doesn’t have the balls to make a decision like that. When asked about his team’s four game losing streak, he calmly looked into the eyes of the reporter and said, “if you think that’s bad, just hold my beer and watch.”
When telling the truth becomes a revolutionary concept, it’s wise to join the revolution
And his solution to that was to move the team's leading scorer to the bench and to start the team's worst scorer.
Lol.
Fire the guy. Now. He's in way over his head.
I tried to tell people back in the spring to calm down about Likekele, that he's not going to change the program for the better, that his numbers at Oklahoma State were a function of time on the floor, not efficiency of production. And his time on the floor was a function of being a likable guy who's also a security blanket for any coach who needs one - and I was afraid Holtmann would be just such a coach.
The point of this post isn't to dump on Likekele, but to highlight in such a great example that Holtmann doesn't know how to win at this level of basketball. He doesn't understand the primacy of punishing, relentless scoring pressure above favoring a defensive-minded approach.
I feel like Holtmann is panicking and reverting back to his security blanket in his defensive-minded approach.
I feel compelled to point out that in the prior three games before Holtmann reinserted Likekele back into the starting lineup Likekele played 11, 24 and 18 minutes against Purdue, Maryland and Minnesota, respectively - producing a grand total of 4 points! So then Holtmann rewards that by giving him the start against Rutgers in which he scores zero points in 18 minutes, in a 4-point OT loss. In fact, OSU has lost all four of those games. I don't really know what problem Holtmann thought he was fixing with that move, but that level of lack of production can't possibly fix anything in a meaningful way. Gayle and Sensebaugh are works in progress, and going to make mistakes, as will Holden. But giving their minutes to Likekele is not the answer.
After seeing that defensive starting lineup today the only thing that surprised me is that Holtmann didn't start Eugene Brown, too, and try to hold Rutgers scoreless to halftime.
Holtmann's just making decisions that an elite coach wouldn't make, and I believe he needs to be making those decisions at some other school.
And somewhere CHB smiles, knowingly...while echoes of "we got him now' ring in their ears... It was always about PoR. Those poor useful idiots...
Throw the bank at Miller.
Do we win another game this year?
This team just isn’t very good this year. They are not able to close out an opponent in the final minutes.
What was it this time? 7 Assists? Nice use of the passing game. They don't even run a good break most of the time. Oh well, the women are unbeaten and I hear the Covelli Center is an actual good environment for bball.
Last time I checked, Sueing just cleared the medical requirements right before the season started. Looked great early on, now looks tired. Etzler should spell Sueing a little bit more until Sueing gets his legs under him. What happens in late February/early March? TBD. Perhaps Sueing pushes through and leads us past the first weekend... time will tell...either way, Holman IS on the hot seat. If it works out, he keeps his job. If this team craps the bed, GOODBYE
It is never right to do what is wrong.
It is never wrong to do what is right.
It is always right to do what is right.