Skull Session: C.J. Stroud's Time to Declare for the NFL Draft is Almost Up, Patience for Chris Holtmann is Wearing Thin and Ohio State Will Have Challengers in the B1G in 2023
My gosh, I haven't loved anything more today than that photo of you and David Lighty. Evidently, OSU basketball this year is a lot harder on you than it is on most other folks. Here's hoping for a 180 in the coming years for both you and OSU BasketBuck fans.
Just play. Have fun. Enjoy the game. -- Michael Jordan
So I have a question..if the transfer window closes, and CJ doesn't declare, does that mean that McCord will be stuck where he is, or does he have an option if he should choose to seek greener pastures? Obviously I don't want either to leave, but it probably has to be frustrating for McCord, especially given the situation...
No, McCord would have until the 18th I believe, and even then he also has a period after spring ball. He could also claim a hardship waver due to CJ needing until the 12th hour to announce. If it was an issue, he would probably be granted an extension.
After today's deadline, he'll have a 15-day window from May 1-15 to enter the portal. If I recall correctly, that is also when Joe Burrow entered the portal after Haskins was named the starter for the upcoming season.
Didn’t day or someone say that the cfp teams players were being given an extended time to make a decision since it was forcing their hand to either stay or go while preparing for the playoffs?
I’ve heard nothing about that. Maybe you’re confusing that with the NCAA extending the 4-game redshirt to 5 so kids could play bowl games and not burn a red shirt?
Didn’t day or someone say that the cfp teams players were being given an extended time to make a decision since it was forcing their hand to either stay or go while preparing for the playoffs?
I never thought at anytime this past season CJ Stroud would be back for another year.
As of this morning, Im at 50/50. CJs NIL value today is $2.8M, it would only go up if he stays. The $ math is really his rookie year vs his final NFL year. But, Could CJ be the ultimate warrior and he literally feels unfinished business in Columbus?
Biggest question I ponder is which way benefits CJ the most by holding off on announcing today???
Either way, sure is a fun little thing to think about in mid January regarding Buckeye Football!!! CJ, either way, get yours!
If he wants to maximize his lifetime earning potential he comes back and wins a Natty and a Heisman. That will set him up for a lifetime of NIL and maximize his NFL contract as #1 overall. Carries a shit ton of risk however.
They needed to be perfect to beat Alabama and Oregon
Far from perfect v Oregon. It would have been a serious blasting and slow oven basting of the Ducks if not for 4 turnovers. But as it were we got Roasted Duck.
I understand the point you were making Chase. Now the B1G Championship v Wisky that year was perfection.
They were also far from perfect against Alabama. They turned the ball over twice in the first half and were down 21-6 midway in the second quarter.
A bunch of empty possessions in the second half prior to 85 Yards Through the Heart of the South, then immediately after that play produced a two-score lead, the defense gave a TD right back to bring it right back to a one score game.
And then there was the all-timer of a coaching brain-fart on Ohio State's last offensive possession. Get the ball back with 2 minutes to play and call three straight plays that only use up <30 seconds of clock, none of which involved handing the ball to Zeke. Alabama gets the ball back with 1:30 left and manages to drive all the way to the Buckeye 40.
Ohio State was the better team and both sides made mistakes so it balanced out, but they certainly weren't perfect.
There was a point in that game, I think late in the 2nd quarter where we were dominating to the point that I actually was starting to feel sorry for the Ducks, but then they finally started to take advantage of our turnovers in the second half, and that feeling went away quickly.
My aim, then, is to whip the Weasels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom. - William Tecumseh Sherman (with apologies)
I’ve seen this asked a lot in the stroud threads, but never answered. Google also didn’t provide a ready answer. Is the deadline 11:59:59 pm or something more like close of business today?
They might not work that late, but it doesn't matter. The way these rules work is that you just need to have submitted the paperwork by the end of the required day - even if nobody is at the office to read your paperwork at 11:55 pm tonight, as long as the transmittal date on your emailed paperwork is "January 16th", it still counts.
Basically akin to how Tax Day works if you're doing a hard copy - if you deliver it to the post office and get it postmarked on April 15th, your taxes are considered on time, even though obviously the IRS themselves won't get it until after the deadline.
Now, I would expect nobody's waiting till 11:55 pm because that'd be a really dumb gamble to take with your career that you won't, idk, suddenly have Internet issues for that last few minutes and end up missing the deadline...but you could. IIRC, there was an NBA player a few years ago who *did* wait until the very last minute to send in his "I want to exercise my contract option" paperwork, something happened to cause his agent to not be able to submit the paperwork in that very last minute, so they ended up missing the paperwork deadline and it became a bit of a mess.
If Jim Knowles defense held up for only one scoring drive series, oh let's say the one where Lathan Ransom was out on an island a la UM, got beat and fell down for good measure, and then OSU went on to beat TCU for a natty...would the pundits be saying that everyone else was chasing UM?
It might cost some transfers and a recruit or two, but the Holtmann experiment has lasted too long. Gene won't pull the plug. I don't think he has the stomach to do the right thing after signing him to an extension. That would be tremendous loss of face. So Buckeye fans will be forced to endure at least another season of painful mediocrity after this travesty before consideration is given to make a needed change.
He’s gone and everyone knows it. If he wasn’t then we would have seen another qb already hitting the portal. He’s the captain of this ship. The captain doesn’t leave the boat and CJ waited until the final day to make it official to show how much this school means to him.
That... or hear me out... he really did/does need until today to make up his mind. The kid would have announced at the end of last week if it was a done deal, but ultimately I do think he goes, but the rumor mill says there's a legit chance so what do I know?
Even when holtmann had good basketball teams he couldn't close out games. He will never be more than a team that makes the big dance but doesn't get out of the first weekend. That might be good for some but I'd like more
We were at that '17 game, and our seats in C deck were directly aligned with where this play took place...still the best game OSU game I've ever witnessed in person, and this is still one of my favorite plays ever--it's forever etched in my memory.
"Thousands of tired, nerve-shaken, over-civilized people are beginning to find out that going to the mountains is going home; that wilderness is a necessity..." -John Muir
If you look at his resume and really dive into stats, nuance, all that jazz...he's pretty mediocre. What do we have to do to get McGuff to be able to coach both squads?
Be careful what you wish for. Two years ago what is being said about Holtmann is exactly what was said about McGuff. And add to that the number of good players he recruited only to see them leave after one or two years. Was not long ago that fans who followed the women's team was calling for his head and hoping to get Katie Smith. Sometimes coaches get a mini run because the stars align. I am not ready to say the McGuff has put his issues behind him yet.
I don't buy one goddam drop of gas in the state of Michigan!
The difference is that McGuff had previously made the Elite 8 at Xavier and won 3 straight conference titles there. He also won the B1G twice in a row (2016-2018). So there was actual evidence that McGuff could get his teams over the hump, and then last year and this year he's got that program rolling.
Holtmann has zero conference titles, zero conference tourney titles, and made the S16 one time at Butler because he got to play Winthrop and then Middle Tennessee State. This is now the fourth time in his six years as a coach his team has lost 4 games in a row in conference play. They blew chances to win the B1G by finishing 0-4 and 1-3 in consecutive years, and blew the easiest path to the Elite 8 in school history by losing to Oral Roberts. How much more evidence do we need to realize this guy just isn't ever going to get it done? Holtmann isn't worthy of holding the clipboard for McGuff.
And where is Butler these days...? Running back an old coach who was out of the game for a few years trying to get their "it" factor back. The Basket Bucks are a rudderless team right now. Entirely to much dribbling and standing around on offence which is nothing new for Hotlman's teams.
Since you mentioned Oral Roberts, they just had a ten game winning streak snapped, we could sure use one of those right about now.
Go Bucks!
Without winners there wouldn't be any gosh darn civilization. We make no apologies for winning or for aiming our entire program toward that goal. - Woody Hayes
Holtman should do some internet surfing and dig up footage on Ralph Miller's Oregon State teams of the 1970's-1980's. Miller's teams were some of the best passing ball movement teams in the history of college basketball.
"We're going to give the ball to dumb-ass and grind meat"--Woody Hayes
I am not against Holtmann going, I think it is definitely time for that. And I hope that McGuff can continue what he is doing and stop losing large number of players to the portal. My only point is that it took McGuff 8 years to get this team where it is at today with a bunch of misses in those previous 8 years. Thinking he could magically make the men's team successful in a year or two is foolish. I also realize that the comment that was made was done a bit tongue in cheek.
I don't buy one goddam drop of gas in the state of Michigan!
How did Ohio State accomplish those feats? Among many reasons, I believe the most important is that the team treated every game as if it were the championship. Because, in a way, they were.
Morning
This is a forum post from a site member. It does not represent the views of Lamplighter LLC unless otherwise noted.
Stroud should announce today that he is entering the NFL draft.
Risking injury when he could have a $20 million/plus signing bonus and a guaranteed contract of close to $40 million wouldn’t be in his best interest.
And some say “he can get insured against injury” if he returns. In reading about that insurance, it isn’t what it is made out to be. Insurance companies have language in them that make it nearly impossible to collect a lot on them. You pretty much have to be completely unable to play again to collect. Just not worth the risk, IMO. Especially when the insurance is usually for “only” $1 million.
I have had too much of some posters here on Eleven Warriors, much like Keith. Too much negativity and trolling for me. Life is too short to deal with this crap.
Take care, Eleven Warriors. This will be my last post here.
AZ was just giving his opinion and it was a good one. Don’t leave it’s just all the snowflakes on this site now. They need someone to toughen them up a little.
How much would the 49ers pay Aaron Rodgers to come play QB for a year? 40 million - 50 million to win a championship? OSU boosters aren’t constrained by a salary cap and OSU football is every bit as big of a business as an NFL team. It’s in the hands of the people that make fortunes off of the team to get a deal done.
CJ could be the "Mike Doss" type leader for 2023 but after 20 years the game and the finances are much different. Not sure it would be greed but prudence to go pro. Most on this site want the best for our Buckeyes.
I read that Titanic story and how it has a "25-Year Later" special coming out In February. If only they had cast Arnold in the movie like they should have!
I know this sounds crazy, but I really hope CJ moves on to the NFL. He's given us three solid years, and now it's time for him to get paid (big time money, not NIL money)...and it's also time for McCord/Brown to shine.
Coach Holtmann has been here seven years, and I've really seen no improvement in the program. He's to be commended for his integrity and commitment to his players, but IMO, it's time to part ways and move on.
Patience with Holtman wearing thin? There is more discussion about synchronized swimming, Titanic, and Swedish dancing than there is about Bball.. That tells you all you need to know.
NCAA hoops regular season is just a tune up for the tournament. Something to watch occasionally. That’s where I have a problem with him. I don’t care if they are a 4 or 9 seed. Just win a few games in the tourney every few years.
At this rate they are trending to be a 4 or a 9 seed in the NIT. Hard to see a W on the upcoming schedule.
Without winners there wouldn't be any gosh darn civilization. We make no apologies for winning or for aiming our entire program toward that goal. - Woody Hayes
"I've been a defender of Chris Holtmann over the years. I think he's an excellent coach who understands basketball and, perhaps more importantly, understands people, leading them to be as great a man as they are basketball players."
Perhaps but on the hardwood, his coaching is ATROCIOUS.....You may like mediocrity but I don't .........Smith made a blunder giving this guy an extension....
I think he's an excellent coach who understands basketball and, perhaps more importantly, understands people, leading them to be as great a man as they are basketball players
I agree on the latter. The former? Not so much.
Ohio State should never settle for sending fewer than one player per year to the league. They recruit better than that, and should always have better talent than that.
I would argue that Holtmann was a safe hire. Six years ago AAU money and buyout of players scandals at the time made the emphasis of running a clean program a top priority. Holtmann bridged that gap until NIL with underperforming teams but a clean program. Time to part ways after this season.
Generally speaking, coaching wins games early in the season, talent wins late in the season. As good players get more experience and develop, talent shows through more than coaching.
The best X's and O's coach in college is probably Bennett at Virginia. He's won a national championship, but has also lost in the first round as a #1 seed and has missed the NCAA tourney twice in 10 years.
Its called perspective. Can we hire someone better than Holtmann? I don't know. Good coaches at mid majors (Creighton, Wichita State) weren't all that interested last time we were looking to hire. The guy people seemed to want most that we had a shot at was Archie Miller and he layed an egg at IU. Now a lot of people want Sean Miller, but what has he accomplished? 17 years as a head coach, no final fours and missed the tournament 6 of those 17 years. I guess it was the 2 great years he had that were vacated for cheating that has everyone salivating.
OSU best bet is to take a shot at a young coach and hope they hit a home run. I agree that if Holtmann can't show a better result by the end of next season, it will be time to look in that direction.
Unfortunately, this is Ohio State basketball. Final four appearances once every decade or two which is the ceiling. Half empty home arena and mind boggling loses to shitty teams is what this program is and for the most part always has been. Not going to change. We are a football school.
OSU did not lead nor ever has led the B1G in conference titles. We were tied for second with IU if you include the 2 vacated co-champs under O'Brien (which neither the B1G nor the NCAA recognizes). We have 20 conference titles, tied for third.
Other than that, I do agree that OSU is a top 20 program, but probably in the third tier of NCAA basketball programs.
Chase, I ran into the OSU Synchro team, and Mary Jo Ruggieri, at St Peters in Rome back in the 90's. Was your mom with the team on that trip?
My aim, then, is to whip the Weasels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom. - William Tecumseh Sherman (with apologies)
Ah, Buckeye Nation shall miss you, CJ, but we will be rooting for you with all our hearts in the future. Just hope you have more weapons surrounding you than Justin Fields has (not) had!
Just play. Have fun. Enjoy the game. -- Michael Jordan
I've probably given more thought to "what should OSU football do" more than anything else in my life other than my family and other life responsibilities. I'm going to try and NOT say anything too crazy here like my typical SEC/ESPN bias/conspiracy theories, nor my other "we need to leave the B1G and either join the SEC or be independent." No, what I'm going to propose is that we simply do what the SEC does and drop one of our conference games (8 instead of 9, like the SEC has), and to play a cupcake the week before TTUN (again, like the SEC does). Nothing controversial, just avoiding one bloodbath game a season, and right before our "rivalry game" like the SEC. See how that goes for a few years.
David Lighty was a true team player. he knew his place on the team, played hard, played great defense, won some games for the Bucks, and most of all didn't do anything that would cost OSU a game it should have otherwise won. I cannot say the same of one his teammates from the same class. Although he was good at times, most games he should have played his role and the Buckeyes would have won a few they actually lost. The Kentucky NCAA tournament game is one of them. The Buckeyes have another player like that on this years team, it would be wise for Holtmann to identify it and nip it in the bud before it becomes a bigger issue (like losing his job).
Speaking of that, Chris' job is solid if the Bucks keep making the tournament each year and winning 20+ games. That being said, he is the equivalent of Earle Bruce, a coach who had good but not great seasons, than was fired when he finally had a 4 loss season. The powers that be are just waiting for the first season for Chris to fail. Chris is a good coach, he probably just doesn't have the right assistants. A little tweaking and he can be great.
Any time you give a man something he doesn't earn, you cheapen him. Our kids earn what they get, and that includes respect - Woody Hayes
Anybody that thinks Holtmann is a good coach needs to re-watch the OSU-Minny game. Both coaches mic'ed up and Holtmann was completely clueless. It was embarrassing.
You are correct, BigCat. Anyone who was on the fence about Holtmann's coaching ability before the OSU-Minnesota all-access game, fell off and landed on the "he doesn't know what the hell he is doing" side.
Just play. Have fun. Enjoy the game. -- Michael Jordan
Comments Show All Comments
The only place you'd see CJ Stroud returning to Ohio State:
Just play. Have fun. Enjoy the game. -- Michael Jordan
So, you're saying there's a chance ....
I'm not trying to win a popularity contest. I'm trying to win football games-- Woody Hayes
I think he is coming back but I love your post
Not happening
No worries. We don’t need him to beat PSU again and be back in CFP.
You think Wisconsin makes it again?
Deflecting AGAIN.
My gosh, I haven't loved anything more today than that photo of you and David Lighty. Evidently, OSU basketball this year is a lot harder on you than it is on most other folks. Here's hoping for a 180 in the coming years for both you and OSU BasketBuck fans.
Just play. Have fun. Enjoy the game. -- Michael Jordan
Ah...Holly Vargo-Brown. Your support of OSU women's athletics makes perfect sense now!
A great read, Eleven Warrior fans. Check it out! https://ohiostatebuckeyes.com/coach/holly-vargo-brown/
Just play. Have fun. Enjoy the game. -- Michael Jordan
Legend.
Class of 2001 - classless since then.
What the hell is going on with the woman's arm in that synchro picture?
I don't always finish my sentences but when I do
She moves in mysterious ways.
They swim like they had a stroke.
Hmm
So I have a question..if the transfer window closes, and CJ doesn't declare, does that mean that McCord will be stuck where he is, or does he have an option if he should choose to seek greener pastures? Obviously I don't want either to leave, but it probably has to be frustrating for McCord, especially given the situation...
Too soon.
No, McCord would have until the 18th I believe, and even then he also has a period after spring ball. He could also claim a hardship waver due to CJ needing until the 12th hour to announce. If it was an issue, he would probably be granted an extension.
This current college football transfer portal window opened on December 5 and will closes 45 days later on January 18, 2023.
"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke
Portal closes Wednesday. McCord will have a chance but he better have a plan in place
After today's deadline, he'll have a 15-day window from May 1-15 to enter the portal. If I recall correctly, that is also when Joe Burrow entered the portal after Haskins was named the starter for the upcoming season.
Didn’t day or someone say that the cfp teams players were being given an extended time to make a decision since it was forcing their hand to either stay or go while preparing for the playoffs?
I’ve heard nothing about that. Maybe you’re confusing that with the NCAA extending the 4-game redshirt to 5 so kids could play bowl games and not burn a red shirt?
That might be it but I was thinking it was a blanket decision that covered both situations. Not sure
Not true. Theu are in the same boat as all others
Don't do it, Sweden. You will soon be overrun by Kevin Bacons.
Was probably a requirement to join NATO
I think they already are
Congrats Chase on the coaching success of your mother. Legendary record for sure.
Question: Does she know anything about football? Can she coach defense? /s. A little Monday morning humor never hurts right?
Absolutely epic song of the day. The message still resonates today. Grew up listening to Black Sabbath in my teen years. This is one of their best.
I'm not trying to win a popularity contest. I'm trying to win football games-- Woody Hayes
I never thought at anytime this past season CJ Stroud would be back for another year.
As of this morning, Im at 50/50. CJs NIL value today is $2.8M, it would only go up if he stays. The $ math is really his rookie year vs his final NFL year. But, Could CJ be the ultimate warrior and he literally feels unfinished business in Columbus?
Biggest question I ponder is which way benefits CJ the most by holding off on announcing today???
Either way, sure is a fun little thing to think about in mid January regarding Buckeye Football!!! CJ, either way, get yours!
If he wants to maximize his lifetime earning potential he comes back and wins a Natty and a Heisman. That will set him up for a lifetime of NIL and maximize his NFL contract as #1 overall. Carries a shit ton of risk however.
Go look at 2.8 vs top 5 draft signing bonuses. Not even close
If he stayed he would have likely doubled his $2.8M.
Like I said. Go see what signing bonuses are for top 10 picks. You’re trying too hard
Ask Peyton, Luck and Herbert about that. Read more than the headlines Bro.
They needed to be perfect to beat Alabama and Oregon
Far from perfect v Oregon. It would have been a serious blasting and slow oven basting of the Ducks if not for 4 turnovers. But as it were we got Roasted Duck.
I understand the point you were making Chase. Now the B1G Championship v Wisky that year was perfection.
Muck Fichigan
They were also far from perfect against Alabama. They turned the ball over twice in the first half and were down 21-6 midway in the second quarter.
A bunch of empty possessions in the second half prior to 85 Yards Through the Heart of the South, then immediately after that play produced a two-score lead, the defense gave a TD right back to bring it right back to a one score game.
And then there was the all-timer of a coaching brain-fart on Ohio State's last offensive possession. Get the ball back with 2 minutes to play and call three straight plays that only use up <30 seconds of clock, none of which involved handing the ball to Zeke. Alabama gets the ball back with 1:30 left and manages to drive all the way to the Buckeye 40.
Ohio State was the better team and both sides made mistakes so it balanced out, but they certainly weren't perfect.
There was a point in that game, I think late in the 2nd quarter where we were dominating to the point that I actually was starting to feel sorry for the Ducks, but then they finally started to take advantage of our turnovers in the second half, and that feeling went away quickly.
#1 & #6 receivers...where's the Biletnikoff award winner? Not top 10.
Holtmann and OSU MBB...apathy. which is the worst feeling to have as a fan. I even paused my YouTube TV membership.
Great song Chase!
Muck Fichigan
Dare I say Ohio State blew them out of the water?
Bawahahaha
It's a sink or swim sport. ;)
Muck Fichigan
Those Swimming Buckeyes have really made a splash!
It is not the swimming team. If they make a splash, they are in trouble.
Fanboy says what?
Fanboy says it is synchronized swimming not swimming. Big difference. You make splashes you finish last
Did you know a College graduate makes $2M+ in learnings than a Non-College graduates?
The Synchronized Swim team has been successful because they pooled their resources.
Everyone then me.
This is going off the deepend pretty quickly.
It’s probably better not to dive into this.
Always great when 11W stays in its own lane with these tangents.
Osu synchronized swimmwrs lap the field.
Muck Fichigan
Osu synchronized swimmwrs lap the field.
Water you guys doing with all these swimming puns?
This thread has sunk to a new low.
My aim, then, is to whip the Weasels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom. - William Tecumseh Sherman (with apologies)
I'm sure they'll rise back up and baptize us with their water work wonders.
Muck Fichigan
I’ve seen this asked a lot in the stroud threads, but never answered. Google also didn’t provide a ready answer. Is the deadline 11:59:59 pm or something more like close of business today?
Good question. I think I saw someone mention the deadline is the 18th but I'm not sure.
I'm not trying to win a popularity contest. I'm trying to win football games-- Woody Hayes
The 18th is for the portal window. Today (at some time) is for draft declaration.
All I can find is the date so it seems they have the entire day to declare. Anytime on the 16th it seems.
Yeah, can’t find anything more than that either so I guess it’s before midnight.
Says it has to be presented to league offices. Can’t believe those guys work past 4:00pm.
They might not work that late, but it doesn't matter. The way these rules work is that you just need to have submitted the paperwork by the end of the required day - even if nobody is at the office to read your paperwork at 11:55 pm tonight, as long as the transmittal date on your emailed paperwork is "January 16th", it still counts.
Basically akin to how Tax Day works if you're doing a hard copy - if you deliver it to the post office and get it postmarked on April 15th, your taxes are considered on time, even though obviously the IRS themselves won't get it until after the deadline.
Now, I would expect nobody's waiting till 11:55 pm because that'd be a really dumb gamble to take with your career that you won't, idk, suddenly have Internet issues for that last few minutes and end up missing the deadline...but you could. IIRC, there was an NBA player a few years ago who *did* wait until the very last minute to send in his "I want to exercise my contract option" paperwork, something happened to cause his agent to not be able to submit the paperwork in that very last minute, so they ended up missing the paperwork deadline and it became a bit of a mess.
If Jim Knowles defense held up for only one scoring drive series, oh let's say the one where Lathan Ransom was out on an island a la UM, got beat and fell down for good measure, and then OSU went on to beat TCU for a natty...would the pundits be saying that everyone else was chasing UM?
It might cost some transfers and a recruit or two, but the Holtmann experiment has lasted too long. Gene won't pull the plug. I don't think he has the stomach to do the right thing after signing him to an extension. That would be tremendous loss of face. So Buckeye fans will be forced to endure at least another season of painful mediocrity after this travesty before consideration is given to make a needed change.
He’s gone and everyone knows it. If he wasn’t then we would have seen another qb already hitting the portal. He’s the captain of this ship. The captain doesn’t leave the boat and CJ waited until the final day to make it official to show how much this school means to him.
That... or hear me out... he really did/does need until today to make up his mind. The kid would have announced at the end of last week if it was a done deal, but ultimately I do think he goes, but the rumor mill says there's a legit chance so what do I know?
Peyton, Luck and Herbert all stayed. And that was before NIL. Im 50/50 right now.
Every year, every player has different sets of circumstances.....NIL or no NIL.
Stroud is gone
Exactly. And Sean Clifford will make a good HS coach.
Even when holtmann had good basketball teams he couldn't close out games. He will never be more than a team that makes the big dance but doesn't get out of the first weekend. That might be good for some but I'd like more
Idk if losing to vtech lit a fire in 14. We struggled all year until the big ten championship hame.
The night game in East Lansing is when I thought that 2014 team had a chance to be special.
Oh good point we went into east Lansing and smacked those boys
I thought for sure Sam Hubbard would get a shoutout in this mornings skully.
muck fichigan
He has his own article on the front page
Yes, that 98 yard run back was special enough to be everywhere on 11W, including here. One of my favorite Buckeyes.
We were at that '17 game, and our seats in C deck were directly aligned with where this play took place...still the best game OSU game I've ever witnessed in person, and this is still one of my favorite plays ever--it's forever etched in my memory.
Faster, tougher, and more violent...
I thought for sure Sam Hubbard would get a shoutout in this mornings skully.
muck fichigan
You can say that again!
"Thousands of tired, nerve-shaken, over-civilized people are beginning to find out that going to the mountains is going home; that wilderness is a necessity..." -John Muir
How is Chris Holtmann an excellent coach?
If you look at his resume and really dive into stats, nuance, all that jazz...he's pretty mediocre. What do we have to do to get McGuff to be able to coach both squads?
"We didn't play with enough force tonight"
Be careful what you wish for. Two years ago what is being said about Holtmann is exactly what was said about McGuff. And add to that the number of good players he recruited only to see them leave after one or two years. Was not long ago that fans who followed the women's team was calling for his head and hoping to get Katie Smith. Sometimes coaches get a mini run because the stars align. I am not ready to say the McGuff has put his issues behind him yet.
I don't buy one goddam drop of gas in the state of Michigan!
The difference is that McGuff had previously made the Elite 8 at Xavier and won 3 straight conference titles there. He also won the B1G twice in a row (2016-2018). So there was actual evidence that McGuff could get his teams over the hump, and then last year and this year he's got that program rolling.
Holtmann has zero conference titles, zero conference tourney titles, and made the S16 one time at Butler because he got to play Winthrop and then Middle Tennessee State. This is now the fourth time in his six years as a coach his team has lost 4 games in a row in conference play. They blew chances to win the B1G by finishing 0-4 and 1-3 in consecutive years, and blew the easiest path to the Elite 8 in school history by losing to Oral Roberts. How much more evidence do we need to realize this guy just isn't ever going to get it done? Holtmann isn't worthy of holding the clipboard for McGuff.
"We didn't play with enough force tonight"
And where is Butler these days...? Running back an old coach who was out of the game for a few years trying to get their "it" factor back. The Basket Bucks are a rudderless team right now. Entirely to much dribbling and standing around on offence which is nothing new for Hotlman's teams.
Since you mentioned Oral Roberts, they just had a ten game winning streak snapped, we could sure use one of those right about now.
Go Bucks!
Without winners there wouldn't be any gosh darn civilization. We make no apologies for winning or for aiming our entire program toward that goal. - Woody Hayes
Holtman should do some internet surfing and dig up footage on Ralph Miller's Oregon State teams of the 1970's-1980's. Miller's teams were some of the best passing ball movement teams in the history of college basketball.
"We're going to give the ball to dumb-ass and grind meat"--Woody Hayes
I am not against Holtmann going, I think it is definitely time for that. And I hope that McGuff can continue what he is doing and stop losing large number of players to the portal. My only point is that it took McGuff 8 years to get this team where it is at today with a bunch of misses in those previous 8 years. Thinking he could magically make the men's team successful in a year or two is foolish. I also realize that the comment that was made was done a bit tongue in cheek.
I don't buy one goddam drop of gas in the state of Michigan!
Tongue-in-cheek indeed.
It's all god my friend - it's healthy for people to have separate opinions and that's what makes sports message boards fun lol
"We didn't play with enough force tonight"
Not just the players IMO
Morning
This is a forum post from a site member. It does not represent the views of Lamplighter LLC unless otherwise noted.
peidiwch â ffycin gyda'r Cymry
Stroud should announce today that he is entering the NFL draft.
Risking injury when he could have a $20 million/plus signing bonus and a guaranteed contract of close to $40 million wouldn’t be in his best interest.
And some say “he can get insured against injury” if he returns. In reading about that insurance, it isn’t what it is made out to be. Insurance companies have language in them that make it nearly impossible to collect a lot on them. You pretty much have to be completely unable to play again to collect. Just not worth the risk, IMO. Especially when the insurance is usually for “only” $1 million.
Shut up nerd. Try to have fun once in your life
Bite one.
I have had too much of some posters here on Eleven Warriors, much like Keith. Too much negativity and trolling for me. Life is too short to deal with this crap.
Take care, Eleven Warriors. This will be my last post here.
AZ was just giving his opinion and it was a good one. Don’t leave it’s just all the snowflakes on this site now. They need someone to toughen them up a little.
Fire Kevin Warren
How much would the 49ers pay Aaron Rodgers to come play QB for a year? 40 million - 50 million to win a championship? OSU boosters aren’t constrained by a salary cap and OSU football is every bit as big of a business as an NFL team. It’s in the hands of the people that make fortunes off of the team to get a deal done.
C.J.is staying...greed doesn't drive everybody like most on this site ....
It isn't greed. It is simple common sense. You would leave too
CJ could be the "Mike Doss" type leader for 2023 but after 20 years the game and the finances are much different. Not sure it would be greed but prudence to go pro. Most on this site want the best for our Buckeyes.
Our people are everywhere, Esto Dignus.
No chance. No way.
Well that didn't age well...lol
Round on the ends and "HI" in the middle. O-HI-O.
I read that Titanic story and how it has a "25-Year Later" special coming out In February. If only they had cast Arnold in the movie like they should have!
This is simultaneously extremely disturbing and hilarious
Hahahahahahah. Never seen that before.
You're too stupid to have a good time. -Dalton
I could have probably gone my whole life not knowing this existed....
I can't get that image out of my head.
I know this sounds crazy, but I really hope CJ moves on to the NFL. He's given us three solid years, and now it's time for him to get paid (big time money, not NIL money)...and it's also time for McCord/Brown to shine.
Coach Holtmann has been here seven years, and I've really seen no improvement in the program. He's to be commended for his integrity and commitment to his players, but IMO, it's time to part ways and move on.
Faster, tougher, and more violent...
Patience with Holtman wearing thin? There is more discussion about synchronized swimming, Titanic, and Swedish dancing than there is about Bball.. That tells you all you need to know.
NCAA hoops regular season is just a tune up for the tournament. Something to watch occasionally. That’s where I have a problem with him. I don’t care if they are a 4 or 9 seed. Just win a few games in the tourney every few years.
At this rate they are trending to be a 4 or a 9 seed in the NIT. Hard to see a W on the upcoming schedule.
Without winners there wouldn't be any gosh darn civilization. We make no apologies for winning or for aiming our entire program toward that goal. - Woody Hayes
CJ signed an Agent this past Thursday. It's just a matter of time today when he announces he will declare for the draft
TTUN SUCKS!
24/7 last night on CJ Stroud.
"I've been a defender of Chris Holtmann over the years. I think he's an excellent coach who understands basketball and, perhaps more importantly, understands people, leading them to be as great a man as they are basketball players."
Perhaps but on the hardwood, his coaching is ATROCIOUS.....You may like mediocrity but I don't .........Smith made a blunder giving this guy an extension....
Saban on a cart eating cold pizza
I agree on the latter. The former? Not so much.
Ohio State should never settle for sending fewer than one player per year to the league. They recruit better than that, and should always have better talent than that.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Tailgate Fare Historical Archive
Holtmann was never a good hire. He was a desperation hire.
Try not to suck
I would argue that Holtmann was a safe hire. Six years ago AAU money and buyout of players scandals at the time made the emphasis of running a clean program a top priority. Holtmann bridged that gap until NIL with underperforming teams but a clean program. Time to part ways after this season.
Our people are everywhere, Esto Dignus.
No shout out to the Puckeyes ? they beat Xichigan !!!
Mark May is a mental midget
Holtmann is an excellent coach???
Developing players for the NBA means nothing if you cannot develop a team by March. In heat respect he has failed miserably.
This is Ohio State. They need to do more than make the second round of the NCAA time after time.
He should have nfbrr been given a contract extension to begin with. He did nothing to earn it.
Generally speaking, coaching wins games early in the season, talent wins late in the season. As good players get more experience and develop, talent shows through more than coaching.
The best X's and O's coach in college is probably Bennett at Virginia. He's won a national championship, but has also lost in the first round as a #1 seed and has missed the NCAA tourney twice in 10 years.
Its called perspective. Can we hire someone better than Holtmann? I don't know. Good coaches at mid majors (Creighton, Wichita State) weren't all that interested last time we were looking to hire. The guy people seemed to want most that we had a shot at was Archie Miller and he layed an egg at IU. Now a lot of people want Sean Miller, but what has he accomplished? 17 years as a head coach, no final fours and missed the tournament 6 of those 17 years. I guess it was the 2 great years he had that were vacated for cheating that has everyone salivating.
OSU best bet is to take a shot at a young coach and hope they hit a home run. I agree that if Holtmann can't show a better result by the end of next season, it will be time to look in that direction.
Unfortunately, this is Ohio State basketball. Final four appearances once every decade or two which is the ceiling. Half empty home arena and mind boggling loses to shitty teams is what this program is and for the most part always has been. Not going to change. We are a football school.
Big B
What a moronic statement.
Facts:
When Holtmann arrived Ohio State led the Big Ten in titles with 22.
When Holtmann arrived Ohio State led the Big Ten in conference tournament titles with 5.
Ohio State leads the Big Ten in Final Four appearances with 11.
Ohio State has finished #1 in the AP poll 4x.
Both the AP and CBS rated OSU as the 12th best basketball program all-time.
Regarding attendance, OSU is almost always top 20. Yes, the arena is oversized and stinks for basketball- but that’s not an indictment of the program.
OSU did not lead nor ever has led the B1G in conference titles. We were tied for second with IU if you include the 2 vacated co-champs under O'Brien (which neither the B1G nor the NCAA recognizes). We have 20 conference titles, tied for third.
Other than that, I do agree that OSU is a top 20 program, but probably in the third tier of NCAA basketball programs.
Facts:
Last time OSU was in the Final Four was 2012 (a decade ago)
Last time OSU won the National Championship was 1960 (good lord)
Last time OSU won the BIG10 was 2013 ( a decade ago)
Holtman has never won the BIG and has never got out of the second round of the NCAA tournament
Dont be a meechigun stooge and go back years and years for irrelavent stats.
Big B
Interesting considering he Tweeted Friday there's no way CJ stays...
CJ is not staying. NIL $ can't touch signing bonus $
The "big news" had nothing to do with CJ. The news was a baby-sex reveal for his wife and himself!
Just play. Have fun. Enjoy the game. -- Michael Jordan
Will this mean less NIL money for our football program?
Chase, I ran into the OSU Synchro team, and Mary Jo Ruggieri, at St Peters in Rome back in the 90's. Was your mom with the team on that trip?
My aim, then, is to whip the Weasels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom. - William Tecumseh Sherman (with apologies)
Ah, Buckeye Nation shall miss you, CJ, but we will be rooting for you with all our hearts in the future. Just hope you have more weapons surrounding you than Justin Fields has (not) had!
Just play. Have fun. Enjoy the game. -- Michael Jordan
I've probably given more thought to "what should OSU football do" more than anything else in my life other than my family and other life responsibilities. I'm going to try and NOT say anything too crazy here like my typical SEC/ESPN bias/conspiracy theories, nor my other "we need to leave the B1G and either join the SEC or be independent." No, what I'm going to propose is that we simply do what the SEC does and drop one of our conference games (8 instead of 9, like the SEC has), and to play a cupcake the week before TTUN (again, like the SEC does). Nothing controversial, just avoiding one bloodbath game a season, and right before our "rivalry game" like the SEC. See how that goes for a few years.
Round on the ends and "HI" in the middle. O-HI-O.
David Lighty was a true team player. he knew his place on the team, played hard, played great defense, won some games for the Bucks, and most of all didn't do anything that would cost OSU a game it should have otherwise won. I cannot say the same of one his teammates from the same class. Although he was good at times, most games he should have played his role and the Buckeyes would have won a few they actually lost. The Kentucky NCAA tournament game is one of them. The Buckeyes have another player like that on this years team, it would be wise for Holtmann to identify it and nip it in the bud before it becomes a bigger issue (like losing his job).
Speaking of that, Chris' job is solid if the Bucks keep making the tournament each year and winning 20+ games. That being said, he is the equivalent of Earle Bruce, a coach who had good but not great seasons, than was fired when he finally had a 4 loss season. The powers that be are just waiting for the first season for Chris to fail. Chris is a good coach, he probably just doesn't have the right assistants. A little tweaking and he can be great.
Any time you give a man something he doesn't earn, you cheapen him. Our kids earn what they get, and that includes respect - Woody Hayes
Anybody that thinks Holtmann is a good coach needs to re-watch the OSU-Minny game. Both coaches mic'ed up and Holtmann was completely clueless. It was embarrassing.
You are correct, BigCat. Anyone who was on the fence about Holtmann's coaching ability before the OSU-Minnesota all-access game, fell off and landed on the "he doesn't know what the hell he is doing" side.
Just play. Have fun. Enjoy the game. -- Michael Jordan